Society Why do Regular Citizens Need Assault Weapons?

[Hauler]

I figured AR stood for assault rifle.

AR stands for ArmaLite, the company that first created the platform in the late 50s. AR-15s are actually produced by multiple manufacturers.

 

[Hauler]

I figured AR stood for assault rifle.

So do most people on the news so don't feel bad.

 

[SensoriaUtopia]

@Splinty

Banning assault weapons is not the be all end all but its a part of it. It's a part of a lot of steps that need to happen.

Conservatives want to do nothing about the gun laws and even think assault weapons are fine and dandy and that its about mental health.

Liberals want to restrict gun laws etc...

What I am saying is we need to do all the above and then some. Stricter gun laws, harsher penalties, better vetting more resources, more staffing and funding for our brave law enforcement. More involved mental health counseling, starting when they are even in high school. More metal detectors, mininum of 3 cops on every high school campus etc...

I am talking about a 20 point plan here. If I even have to pay a bit more taxes for this to happen, I will happily do that. If all of us losing 50 bucks from our tax returns can be reinvested, with 100% transparency into measures directly making our society safer, it needs to happen.

I want a nuanced and involved and actual 20 step or more plan.

 

[Deleted member 1]

Banning assault weapons is not the be all end all but its a part of it. It's a part of a lot of steps that need to happen.

Again, based on what?
Data says it doesn't work. Show me otherwise.


P.S. Splintys foundation for gun reform:
Obama set to fix gun laws (FINALLY) | Page 11 | TMMAC - The MMA Community Forum

 

[Hauler]

mininum of 3 cops on every high school campus etc...

22,000 high schools
90,000 elementary schools
That's 112,000 schools.
x3 = 336,000 cops
Let's say they make $50,000 a year just to pick a number.

That's $16,800,000,000 dollars. Every year.
And that's using very conservative numbers.

 

[SensoriaUtopia]

Again, based on what?
Data says it doesn't work. Show me otherwise.


P.S. Splintys foundation for gun reform:
Obama set to fix gun laws (FINALLY) | Page 11 | TMMAC - The MMA Community Forum

That stat does not really paint a true pic. Of course more die from pistols because more people own those. But that still does not change the fact that less would die if we did not have assault weapons.


If there are 10 school shootings in 4 months.

If 8 of them are done by people with pistols, and 2 are done by people with assault weapons that dont mean we need to just say "see 4 shooting to every 1 are regular ol pistols"

That's just a weird logic to me. A lot of things needs to happen and assault weapons ban is one of them.

I have yet to hear a good reason why an ordinary citizen should have an assault weapon or even worse a shit ton of them. You can't hunt with that, it fucks up the animal you are trying to eat. You don't need it to protect your house, a pistol or shotgun works fine. So what does an ordinary citizen say to justify owning that?

 

[SensoriaUtopia]

22,000 high schools
90,000 elementary schools
That's 112,000 schools.
x3 = 336,000 cops
Let's say they make $50,000 a year just to pick a number.

That's $16,800,000,000 dollars. Every year.
And that's using very conservative numbers.

It needs to happen. We can't let the fact that it wont be easy or cheap stop us. It needs to happen. We need to suck it up, maybe even give back some tax money, maybe cut out some bs programs, whatever, but it needs to happen. Our children deserve to be safe.

 

[Deleted member 1]

I have yet to hear a good reason why an ordinary citizen should have an assault weapon or even worse a shit ton of them.

To be fair, it doesn't seem like you know what an assault weapon is or why somebody shouldn't have it.

That stat does not really paint a true pic. Of course more die from pistols because more people own those. But that still does not change the fact that less would die if we did not have assault weapons.

Alright forget it. I was trying to point you to a thread where we were already talking General gun reform. This is why I was talking past you and staying only on assault weapons.

I asked about the data for assault weapons ban. I told you why I would not support another one. You said you think it would do something.
So, go ahead...Show me data that enacting an assault weapons ban would make a measurable difference. Ten years of it and multiple studies including the government's own investigation do not support it.

 

[Deleted member 1]

It needs to happen. We can't let the fact that it wont be easy or cheap stop us. It needs to happen. We need to suck it up, maybe even give back some tax money, maybe cut out some bs programs, whatever, but it needs to happen. Our children deserve to be safe.

Children would be safe in schools built like fortresses.

It's likely really expensive, leave children with a weird social mental outcome of always being anxious and scared in a fortress mindset, and might not have enough effect.

Should we look at things that are most effective and spend the money there?

 

[SensoriaUtopia]

To be fair, it doesn't seem like you know what an assault weapon is or why somebody shouldn't have it.




Alright forget it. I was trying to point you to a thread where we were already talking General gun reform. This is why I was talking past you and staying only on assault weapons.

I asked about the data for assault weapons ban. I told you why I would not support another one. You said you think it would do something.
So, go ahead...Show me data that enacting an assault weapons ban would make a measurable difference. Ten years of it and multiple cities including the government's own investigation do not support it.

Stop playing around the question.

You avoided my simple logic. You think because more people die from pistols is some kind of point that means assault weapons are okay. Is that really how logic works for you? That is completely insane to me. More people die in car accident but I still think a truck should be made road safe. Just because more people die by a pistol dont mean that makes it okay for a citizen to have a assault weapon, what the fuck kind of thinking would that be.

Also, you still , as most people with your view, can't even articulate why a citizen needs or should be having assault weapon, particularly weapons.

You can't hutn with it. You don't need it to protect your house.

 

[SensoriaUtopia]

Children would be safe in schools built like fortresses.

It's likely really expensive, leave children with a weird social mental outcome of always being anxious and scared in a fortress mindset, and might not have enough effect.

Should we look at things that are most effective and spend the money there?

You really are why the problem exists, your line of thinking is a jaded and warped line of thinking. Anyone with any kind of reflection knows we need more security and cops on school grounds. you think its better to have kids murdered and their families lives destroyed just so their school does not feel like a fortress.

Bullshit, you flat out wrong, you could not be more wrong either.

 

[Deleted member 1]

Stop playing around the question.

I can't be more clear.
I pointed you today. That says it doesn't work. I gave reasons why going down that route is bad.
With zero data and zero reference to data for me to go look up, response was simply that you disagree it will work.

So please show me the data that assault weapons ban will make a measurable difference in the outcomes were talking about.

Also, you still , as most people with your view, can't even articulate why a citizen needs or should be having assault weapon, particularly weapons.

You've already read two of my post in which I responded to it.

 

[Hauler]

You can't hunt with that, it fucks up the animal you are trying to eat.

No it doesn't. It passes through the animal without killing it because it is too small of a caliber. That's why the AR isn't typically used while hunting.

 

[SensoriaUtopia]

No it doesn't. It passes through the animal without killing it because it is too small of a caliber. That's why the AR isn't typically used while hunting.

I am talking about assault weapons, not the AR 15

 

[Disciplined Galt]

I can't be more clear.
I pointed you today. That says it doesn't work. I gave reasons why going down that route is bad.
With zero data and zero reference to data for me to go look up, response was simply that you disagree it will work.

So please show me the data that assault weapons ban will make a measurable difference in the outcomes were talking about.



You've already read two of my post in which I responded to it.

Watch that heart. You fat fuck.

 

[SensoriaUtopia]

I can't be more clear.
I pointed you today. That says it doesn't work. I gave reasons why going down that route is bad.
With zero data and zero reference to data for me to go look up, response was simply that you disagree it will work.

So please show me the data that assault weapons ban will make a measurable difference in the outcomes were talking about.



You've already read two of my post in which I responded to it.

Nah, you just play around the question like your a lawyer for Trump or something.

You could have easily straight up answered the question and not play around with your riddles. All I took from you was that it would piss off people, 1/3 of people, as if that makes it just.

 

[Ted Williams' head]

I thought abortion arguments were the dumbest, but it's definitely gun control. The loudest anti-gun voices are always the most ignorant on guns.

People are talking about automatic weapons and it's like... what fucking mass shooting was done with automatic weapons that you can think of? Fucking fruits.

 

[Disciplined Galt]

I thought abortion arguments were the dumbest, but it's definitely gun control. The loudest anti-gun voices are always the most ignorant on guns.

People are talking about automatic weapons and it's like... what fucking mass shooting was done with automatic weapons that you can think of? Fucking fruits.

Should have automatic dildos amirite @Banchan ?

 

[Deleted member 1]

You really are why the problem exists, your line of thinking is a jaded and warped line of thinking.

What kind of school did you go to?
I went to rough shitty schools that instituted prison-like Concepts. It was pretty fucked up many times and often suppressed learning and freethought in exchange for control. Regular Behavior was criminalized and simple acts of teenager expression like hairstyles or clothing styles were suppressed, often resulting in kids acting out in different ways to explore their personalities and individualism.

In the effort to keep children safe we should not screw them up further.

I'm not really sure why you got all personal all of a sudden.

Anyone with any kind of reflection knows we need more security and cops on school grounds

Beyond the fallacy of you once again attacking my character because of a disagreement in position...

I don't know that. I think there is a lot of issues with having schools be more militarized or more prison like.

I have major concerns with school districts operating their own police departments vs calling the Municipal Police Department.

I think criminalizing teenager behavior in schools can lead to some really bad societal outcomes.

I'm not sure it's a good use of money. Why 3 cops and not 4 or 2?

you think its better to have kids murdered and their families lives destroyed just so their school does not feel like a fortress.

Is that an accurate dichotomy? Or a false one?

Is it only Fortress schools or murdered children? I would have thought there be more options here somewhere in that gradient.

 

[Deleted member 1]

Nah, you just play around the question like your a lawyer for Trump or something.

You could have easily straight up answered the question and not play around with your riddles. All I took from you was that it would piss off people, 1/3 of people, as if that makes it just.

Hey knucklehead, assault weapons bans don't work and there's no data for it. I've referenced several things that show it was studied after already being enacted and it doesn't work. It's not a good use of legislative power.

You said you disagreed. It would work. Please show me otherwise.

I've said that about 3 times. And you keep accusing me of not answering. Clear enough?

 

[Deleted member 1]

I am talking about assault weapons, not the AR 15

"

 

[Ted Williams' head]

I own a GSG 15, when I show people they get scared because of it's shape and black colour (unconscious racism?). They have no idea it's actually a really gay peashooter 22 that's only good for casual target shooting. And these are the same sumbitches that want to dictate gun policy. lol

 

[SensoriaUtopia]

Hey knucklehead, assault weapons bans don't work and there's no data for it. I've referenced several things that show it was studied after already being enacted and it doesn't work. It's not a good use of legislative power.

You said you disagreed. It would work. Please show me otherwise.

I've said that about 3 times. And you keep accusing me of not answering. Clear enough?

Are you for real? I am pointing out to that your premise is bullshit. You are saying because stat wise more people die other ways that it makes no difference, that is some horribly horrendous logic. Just because more die in other ways does not mean we don't need to ban assault weapons.

More people die in car crashes than attending a nascar event, but as soon as people where killed at an event that took steps to avoid it happening again, they did not say "hey well since most die other ways we can just turn a blind eye"

Again, your point of view and others who share it are why as a society we are in this spot. You make excuse after excuse for assault weapons and don't want to do anything.

 

[Hauler]

I am talking about assault weapons, not the AR 15

It doesn't feel like it.

 

[Ted Williams' head]

More people die in car crashes than attending a nascar event, but as soon as people where killed at an event that took steps to avoid it happening again, they did not say "hey well since most die other ways we can just turn a blind eye"
.

That's true, people do that a lot. I wish I had a dollar for every asshole who says "you're more likely to get killed driving to the airport than on a plane crash". Thanks dickhead, that'll be a real comfort to me when I'm plummeting to the ground from 30k feet.