Fedor set to begin negotiations with EFN no UFC

[wiz]

You are free to your opinion. I watched all of these fights happen when they did. Did you? You obviously are not a fan of Fedor as you are one of the first people to jump in and attack his career. Do I think fEdor beats Hendo and Werdum in Pride yes. In fact I think he beats them both an hour after he fought them the first time. Bigfoot was a roided out beast at the time that had 70lbs on him. Don't think that was ever a good matchup for him. Especially after 35 career fights.
The can talk of Fedor is a joke as well. He was fighting 4-6 times a year and yes a couple a year were not on his level.
If gsp fought Hughes, Shawn Michael, Bj Penn, Mayhem Miller then Donald Trump on new years to round the year out. Would you say he was a can crusher or fought a few low level fighters but fought 5 times. Or would you prefer Gsp fought Hughes then Bj 8 months later.
As far as not fighting some of the ufc guys. Fedor was the undisputed king for 10 years why did the ufc guys not go to pride or Affliction to fight the best?
I've said it before. I don't care if you don't think fEdor is the best. Even thought he was to me. But if you don't think he is a top 5 fighter of all time I question every option one has after that.

Absolutely I watched every single one of those fights live.

Don't get me wrong, he is a legend for what he accomplished. He went on a very long streak. I respect that. But he just did not fight all the top guys that were around during his reign. It got shady after 2005. Not that he had to fight every single one obviously, but: Couture, Barnett, Gonzaga, Mir, Overeem, Lesnar, any top LHW including ones in Pride, etc. Considering the three guys he lost to in devastating fashion: Werdum, Bigfoot, and Henderson, you kind of scratch your head and wonder how he would have done against the previous guys I mentioned back in the day (meaning 2010 and before). Hell, Anderson fought 8-0 Chris Weidman, didn't he? So it's not out of the question that Fedor could have fought guys Cain, JDS, and Carwin if he came to the UFC. It's very likely that he loses to those guys too.

Just too many potential threats that Fedor did not face. I don't care if Fedor killed a 1000 cans as long as he faced more of the guys I mentioned. Even just 3-4 of them and I would okay with that.

The reason why I am being nitpicky is that we are comparing Fedor to guys like Jones, Aldo, Anderson, GSP, who faced one top well rounded threat after another. There is not a doubt in my mind that Fedor would have lost to Barnett and Brock Lesnar in 2009 and Overeem in 2010. If he loses those fights, is he still the greatest like many of his fans say?

And I dont see how Fedor beats Werdum and Hendo back then. They are just too well rounded for him and they would have finished him again.

 

[wiz]

I also find it funny. That for a fighter that people seem to think was overrated he is constantly talked about. It is almost as if people think that if they say he wasn't that good or didn't fight the best it will somehow become true. Anderson Is 0-3-1 in his last 4. Don't see people bashing him. In fact he was praised for just fighting and surviving. Fedor fights gets beat on bad yet survives showing unbelievable heart and he is a bum. GSP wins a controversial dec. Then runs into retirement using steroids as an excuse. Just maybe a guy who fought safe for years realized he was about to start to get crushed.

Do I think Fedor beats Brock now. I can't say for sure he would. But I would bet my house he doesn't try to out point him(GSP) or throw 3 punches (HUNT). Win or lose he is leaving it all in the cage everytime.

No one is saying that Fedor isn't one of the most exciting fighters to ever walk the Earth, because he is. But I try to be objective when I compare careers.

Anderson just had a very close fight with the current middleweight champion. Do you honestly see Fedor doing well against Stipe Miocic at this point in his career? I definitely don't.

 

[MMAHAWK]

Absolutely I watched every single one of those fights live.

Don't get me wrong, he is a legend for what he accomplished. I respect that. But he just did not fight all the top guys that were around during his reign. Not that he had to fight every single one obviously, but: Couture, Barnett, Gonzaga, Mir, Overeem, Lesnar, any top LHW including ones in Pride, etc. Considering the three guys he lost to in devastating fashion: Werdum, Bigfoot, and Henderson, you kind of scratch your head and wonder how he would have done against the previous guys I mentioned back in the day. Hell, Anderson fought 8-0 Chris Weidman, didn't he? So it's not out of the question that Fedor could have fought guys Cain, JDS, and Carwin if he came to the UFC. It's very likely that he loses to those guys too.

Just too many potential threats that Fedor did not face. I don't care if Fedor killed a 1000 cans as long as he faced more of the guys I mentioned.

The reason why I am being nitpicky is that we are comparing Fedor to guys like Jones, Aldo, Anderson, GSP, who faced one top well rounded threat after another. There is not a doubt in my mind that Fedor would have lost to Barnett and Brock Lesnar in 2009 and Overeem in 2010. If he loses those fights, is he still the greatest like many of his fans say?

And I dont see how Fedor beats Werdum and Hendo back then. They are just too well rounded for him and they would have finished him again.

While I disagree on some points very good post.
I don't consider Brock well rounded so even a win would be used against him in this arguement.
Mir, Randy, Gonzaga have no excuse for not going to pride to fight the best Ricco and Chuck did.
Not here to bash the other greats but Andeson didn't exactly beat well rounder wrestlers other that Dan.
GSP fought to win on points and Jones beat a bunch of Middleweights and washed up ex champs if we are going this route.

 

[MMAHAWK]

No one is saying that Fedor isn't one of the most exciting fighters to ever walk the Earth, because he is. But I try to be objective when I compare careers.

Anderson just had a very close fight with the current middleweight champion. Do you honestly see Fedor doing well against Stipe Miocic at this point in his career? I definitely don't.

If Miocic had no intention of causing any damage then yes. You can't honestly say that Daniel tried to damage Silva in any way.

 

[wiz]

While I disagree on some points very good post.
I don't consider Brock well rounded so even a win would be used against him in this arguement.
Mir, Randy, Gonzaga have no excuse for not going to pride to fight the best Ricco and Chuck did.
Not here to bash the other greats but Andeson didn't exactly beat well rounder wrestlers other that Dan.
GSP fought to win on points and Jones beat a bunch of Middleweights and washed up ex champs if we are going this route.

Thanks. I respect your opinion.

I mean Anderson did beat Chael 2x (the second time chael had much improved BJJ), Maia who has good takedowns and Okami who is a good strong wrestler

LOL Jones? C'mon man. Cormier, Gustaffson, Machida, Glover, Evans? Evans hasn't been down to middleweight once and he used to fight at HW. There is literally no one else that Jones can fight at LHW now besides Johnson....I don't know how you can criticize him when Fedor has a bunch more guys he never faced while Jones has literally 1 dude left. Sorry bro Im gonna have disagree on that one, Jones has passed Fedor miles ago.

 

[MMAHAWK]

Thanks. I respect your opinion.

I mean Anderson did beat Chael 2x (the second time chael had much improved BJJ), Maia who has good takedowns and Okami who is a good strong wrestler

LOL Jones? C'mon man. Cormier, Gustaffson, Machida, Glover, Evans? Evans hasn't been down to middleweight once and he used to fight at HW. There is literally no one else that Jones can fight at LHW now besides Johnson....I don't know you can criticize him when Fedor had has a bunch more guys he never faced while Jones has one.

Don't thin Maia, and Chael were well rounded.
I have nothing but respect for Jones as a fighter. He beat everyone that he could. More playing devils advocate because if he comes back he will eventually lose a couple fights. It happens to everyone. Then when we are on this forum in 10 years we will be defending him against newer fans that will say Chael, Machida,and Vitor were MW. That Rashad got beat to hell by Bader. Gus got KO'd in a minute by Johnson and so on.

You are clearly educated on the sport and it's history. But I've found most of Fedors detractors never really watched him prior to strikeforce. I see this no different than an NBA fan that only saw Jordan play for the wizards and using that against him in his historical ranking.
If you've seen my other posts you know I will defend the pioneers till the end. And I just don't understand why MMA fans feel the need to discredit the legends of the sport as the age and decline.

 

[stielar]

This discussion is getting really old. I know by reading the name of the poster what he's going to write about. Wiz, Teamquestnorth, NDNH and the beard guy or whatever the johnny hendricks' fan name is are going to drink their koolaid and shit on Fedor, me, mmahawk, bjjmma, galt and others will put him on a pedestal and consider him the greatest ever.

None of us will ever convince the other person, so this conversation is getting old, we're just going in circles saying the exact same things. I won't reply to any of the haters anymore just out of sheer boredom. I'll be just responding to the posts having to do with the current Fedor and what he's up to at the moment.

 

[MMAHAWK]

This discussion is getting really old. I know by reading the name of the poster what he's going to write about. Wiz, Teamquestnorth, NDNH and the beard guy or whatever the johnny hendricks' fan name is are going to drink their koolaid and shit on Fedor, me, mmahawk, bjjmma, galt and others will put him on a pedestal and consider him the greatest ever.

None of us will ever convince the other person, so this conversation is getting old, we're just going in circles saying the exact same things. I won't reply to any of the haters anymore just out of sheer boredom. I'll be just responding to the posts having to do with the current Fedor and what he's up to at the moment.

While I agree with this. It is sure nice to be able to argue with educated mma fans. Everyone has opinions and as long as it doesn't become trolling and name calling I can a least respect theirs.

 

[stielar]

While I agree with this. It is sure nice to be able to argue with educated mma fans. Everyone has opinions and as long as it doesn't become trolling and name calling I can a least respect theirs.

I just figured, at the end of the day, what matters what I or wiz think about whether Fedor is the goat or not? Fedor certainly doesn't care, he's just enjoying his time, making 2 million per fight, watching basketball with his family while giving zero fucks:

source: touch

Rutten had asked the guy, how do you want to be remembered and Fedor said as a nice person.

He didn't fight him, but oh he was undefeated for so long, but he didn't fight in the ufc, but he fought in pride bla blla bla, same arguments from the same people all the time. It's been what, 6 years now the same discussions over and over again, here and on other boards.

 

[BJJMMA]

I just figured, at the end of the day, what matters what I or wiz think about whether Fedor is the goat or not? Fedor certainly doesn't care, he's just enjoying his time, making 2 million per fight, watching basketball with his family while giving zero fucks:

source: touch

Rutten had asked the guy, how do you want to be remembered and Fedor said as a nice person.

He didn't fight him, but oh he was undefeated for so long, but he didn't fight in the ufc, but he fought in pride bla blla bla, same arguments from the same people all the time. It's been what, 6 years now the same discussions over and over again, here and on other boards.

While I agree with this. It is sure nice to be able to argue with educated mma fans. Everyone has opinions and as long as it doesn't become trolling and name calling I can a least respect theirs.

This discussion is getting really old. I know by reading the name of the poster what he's going to write about. Wiz, Teamquestnorth, NDNH and the beard guy or whatever the johnny hendricks' fan name is are going to drink their koolaid and shit on Fedor, me, mmahawk, bjjmma, galt and others will put him on a pedestal and consider him the greatest ever.

None of us will ever convince the other person, so this conversation is getting old, we're just going in circles saying the exact same things. I won't reply to any of the haters anymore just out of sheer boredom. I'll be just responding to the posts having to do with the current Fedor and what he's up to at the moment.

All true on the circular argument. I always say I'm not going to debate it and then I do. Worse than a crackhead.