General The contemptible concept of 'white privilege' is just ugly, angry racism

[Leigh]

This is how the discussion has gone:

Blank: I'm white, I want my kids to grow up in a white environment. Black communities have higher rates of crime and violence.
Leigh: that's an example of white privilege.
Blank: no it isn't. You don't even know what white privilege is. It isn't real.
Leigh: it's not being the subject of racism against non whites.
Blank: we're all racist. Blacks and Asians are assholes.
Leigh: ...
Blank: Sorry
Leigh: ok
Blank: here's an example of something and it isn't white privilege.
Leigh: that IS an example of white privilege.
Blank: OMG, stop clinging to that example!
Leigh: ...
Blank: Asians do well, therefore white privilege doesn't exist.
Leigh: Asians do well, despite white privilege.
Blank: gotcha!
Leigh: ...
Blank: you're religious

 

[RaginCajun]

I used to get rocks thrown at me as a kid by natives and whites who said I killed Jesus.

It was a privilege

I guess we all can't be his chosen people.



Ps. I don't know if you all know each other, but if so, can you have Lizzy Caplan call me. Thanks

 

[jason73]

those white south africans dont seem to be very privileged right now

 

[member 3289]

I truly hope that people start to get @Khabib Fears Conor and me mixed up

 

[member 1013]

I guess we all can't be his chosen people.



Ps. I don't know if you all know each other, but if so, can you have Lizzy Caplan call me. Thanks

She said she’s calling


The police

U creepy stalker guy you

 

[MMAHAWK]

You're talking to the most ignored memeber of the forum. Now you know why. Another retard.

Yeah I blocked that Assault retard weeks ago. I have yet to hear any good reason why any forum needs Assault retards.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

That is a psychological definition of racism rather than a sociological one, which is more suited to conversations about privilege. I think the term becomes alienating because people of European ancestry think they're being accused of psychological racism, which they wouldn't entirely be aware of anyway, rather than understanding that they benefit from a social construction that was from its origins meant to exclude and marginalize people based on both skin color and cultural ancestry.

You don't get to do that. Psychology is itself a social construct and itself only exists because we believe it does. The term alienates people of European ancestry for a variety of reasons among them being that most people of European ancestry have in no way shape or form benefited form yet they're regularly told they have a leg up.

My issue with the concept of privilege is that it creates a false hierarchy, and is in itself incredibly counterproductive.

 

[1031]

The epitomy of a straw man. I'm waiting for you to go full Godwin next.

Look dude, you've got nothing concrete when it comes to specifics. Everyone reading this has seen as much.
Here it is again:
When you wrote that society treated white people better, I asked you who society was. The question still stands, who exactly is society and how exactly does "it" treat white people better?
I asked you how you would remedy this supposed privilege. If it's as evident as you and others claim it to be the by all means, please suggest some ideas on how to remedy it.

 

[member 1013]

You guys you don’t even realize how privileged you are to fight about privilege you guys

 

[1031]

You're talking to the most ignored memeber of the forum. Now you know why. Another retard.

I try not to ignore people unless they go out of their way to try and twist or manipulate a conversation. Kwinjitsu just comes across as a guy who has his identity wrapped up in his skin colour but would accuse anyone else of racism for feeling the same way if that person wasn't part of an ethnic minority. He's predictable but it's kind of interesting to see that there are people who really operate like he does.

 

[1031]

This is how the discussion has gone:

Blank: I'm white, I want my kids to grow up in a white environment. Black communities have higher rates of crime and violence.
Leigh: that's an example of white privilege.
Blank: no it isn't. You don't even know what white privilege is. It isn't real.
Leigh: it's not being the subject of racism against non whites.
Blank: we're all racist. Blacks and Asians are assholes.
Leigh: ...
Blank: Sorry
Leigh: ok
Blank: here's an example of something and it isn't white privilege.
Leigh: that IS an example of white privilege.
Blank: OMG, stop clinging to that example!
Leigh: ...
Blank: Asians do well, therefore white privilege doesn't exist.
Leigh: Asians do well, despite white privilege.
Blank: gotcha!
Leigh: ...
Blank: you're religious

Well, no it hasn't.
I didn't write I would want my kids to grow up in a white environment and I didn't link that to black communities having higher crime rates.
I guess that's a somewhat entertaining one-sided caricature of the conversation but that's about it.
I don't know why you're stooping this low Leigh, it makes you look like a shit head.

 

[Leigh]

Well, no it hasn't.
I didn't write I would want my kids to grow up in a white environment and I didn't link that to black communities having higher crime rates.

Well, you did say this:

I am white, I would want my child to grow up in an environment I understand.

And you said this in the same post:

That said, I think we both agree that crime and violence seem to be higher among black communities, but is that because white people are privileged? It just doesn't make sense to think that way imo.

I guess that's a somewhat entertaining one-sided caricature of the conversation but that's about it.
I don't know why you're stooping this low Leigh, it makes you look like a shit head.

Says the guy who completely misrepresents my position and then criticises me based on the incorrect position, telling me I'm not balanced, I'm religious and that I can't explain my argument.

I find it truly incredible that someone who openly admits to being racist and makes racist statements thinks that racism isn't real. And has the audacity to call anyone else a shithead. You've got some big brass balls to take that position.

 

[IschKabibble]

"White" and "people of color" make me laugh.

You guys seriously have nothing better to discuss other than these two worthless classifications?

 

[1031]

Well, you did say this:

I did not say a higher crime rate in black communities was the reason I would not want to have a black child in a black community. But that was a typo you quoted, I put an extra "didn't" in there, it was a simple mistake. If you had been at all interested in any kind of real dialogue you would have inquired.
Jesus fuck dude, your approach has been to try go on constant attack mode or feign humor instead of actually supporting any of your ideas. I get that it's a tactic but that's all it is, it lacks substance.

Says the guy who completely misrepresents my position and then criticises me based on the incorrect position, telling me I'm not balanced, I'm religious and that I can't explain my argument.

No, you're not religious, I wrote it as a metaphor, which I'm sure you understood and are being disingenuous about it now. The idea is, if you subscribe to something you can't quantify then it's a bit like someone who's religious. You have often criticized the religious concept of faith so I've put up a mirror for you and you're refusing to acknowledge your reflection.

I find it truly incredible that someone who openly admits to being racist and makes racist statements thinks that racism isn't real. And has the audacity to call anyone else a shithead. You've got some big brass balls to take that position.

Well you've got a something of a point there, I should have written everyone is tribalistic and not racist, that's an error on my behalf. One way people identify with a tribe (often it's completely in their mind) is based on appearance but there are other ways and I should have kept my wording accurate to that idea.
Anyhow, you know and I know that you've just chosen the wrong argument and your ego can't let you admit that.
Have a good one.

 

[kneeblock]

You don't get to do that. Psychology is itself a social construct and itself only exists because we believe it does. The term alienates people of European ancestry for a variety of reasons among them being that most people of European ancestry have in no way shape or form benefited form yet they're regularly told they have a leg up.

My issue with the concept of privilege is that it creates a false hierarchy, and is in itself incredibly counterproductive.

"Psychology is a social construct" is not a very useful contribution to this conversation. We're defining concepts and each discipline uses them differently and has a whole different set of theories attached to them. Not disambiguating the terms is lazy and it allows something complicated to just be discussed based on gut reactions. But when we're talking about these ideas, there is a history behind them, tied to political economies and social configurations long before they just became part of culture. Though there is some evidence that their psychological origins may be linked to something else entirely.

The hierarchy you're describing is one way to look at it, but a better way would be to envision a network:

Each point is a node and each line is an edge. Nodes with a lot of edges have a higher degree of centrality, which is to say ultimately they have more advantages for connection, distribution, etc in the graph. Some nodes are blocked or isolated by their distance from the center and cannot interact without passage through more central nodes. In this paradigm, whiteness is concentrated at the center of our social organization because of preexisting societal conditions, which may be reinforced by personal psychological motivations. Of course, nodes can gain a higher degree of centrality by connecting to each other, but if our modern configuration is preset, imagine power and influence generally diffusing the way you see the purple spreading in the animation above.

Note: this graph is not mapping race or anything to do with it and I'm not sure what the claim of the creator was. It's just used for illustrative purposes to differentiate a network society from a hierarchical one, which is apt when discussing the way privilege manifests versus say systemic racism like Jim Crow or Apartheid.

 

[Leigh]

I did not say a higher crime rate in black communities was the reason I would not want to have a black child in a black community. But that was a typo you quoted, I put an extra "didn't" in there, it was a simple mistake. If you had been at all interested in any kind of real dialogue you would have inquired.
Jesus fuck dude, your approach has been to try go on constant attack mode or feign humor instead of actually supporting any of your ideas. I get that it's a tactic but that's all it is, it lacks substance.

No, you're not religious, I wrote it as a metaphor, which I'm sure you understood and are being disingenuous about it now. The idea is, if you subscribe to something you can't quantify then it's a bit like someone who's religious. You have often criticized the religious concept of faith so I've put up a mirror for you and you're refusing to acknowledge your reflection.

Well you've got a something of a point there, I should have written everyone is tribalistic and not racist, that's an error on my behalf. One way people identify with a tribe (often it's completely in their mind) is based on appearance but there are other ways and I should have kept my wording accurate to that idea.
Anyhow, you know and I know that you've just chosen the wrong argument and your ego can't let you admit that.
Have a good one.

You've been schooled at every turn, to the point that you've had to correct yourself more than once. You're literally criticising me for quoting you and for responding to your examples.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

"Psychology is a social construct" is not a very useful contribution to this conversation.

Although I understand the point you're making, I disagree in the sense that it leads to people picking and choosing what they believe is or isn't fact.

The hierarchy you're describing is one way to look at it, but a better way would be to envision a network

That's just a different side of the same coin. Whether you treat it as a pyramid, or a network you end up with people being classed by things entirely beyond their control.

which is apt when discussing the way privilege manifests versus say systemic racism like Jim Crow or Apartheid.

Are you suggesting that privilege and systemic discrimination aren't inherently connected? I'm certainly willing to be educated, but that seems kind of crazy.

 

[IschKabibble]

I'm curious to know where over a quarter of a million white men dying to secure the rights of black America during our civil war falls on the white privilege table of quantification.

 

[kneeblock]

That's just a different side of the same coin. Whether you treat it as a pyramid, or a network you end up with people being classed by things entirely beyond their control.

That's it precisely.

Are you suggesting that privilege and systemic discrimination aren't inherently connected? I'm certainly willing to be educated, but that seems kind of crazy

.

They are, but when I say "systemic racism" here, I'm speaking about a societal organization that formally totalizes racism into its political economy. What we today call privilege is an artifact of that.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

What we today call privilege is an artifact of that.

That's where we disagree. I believe that the current socioeconomic standings are artifacts of systemic racism. However, I don't agree that those are privileges bestowed on people based solely on the color of their skin or their gender. Yes, I realize how contradictory that seems.

 

[Leigh]

That's where we disagree. I believe that the current socioeconomic standings are artifacts of systemic racism. However, I don't agree that those are privileges bestowed on people based solely on the color of their skin or their gender. Yes, I realize how contradictory that seems.

I kinda agree. Black people historically were treated badly and that is still rippling through society today. That, in and of itself, isn't evidence of white privilege.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

I kinda agree. Black people historically were treated badly and that is still rippling through society today. That, in and of itself, isn't evidence of white privilege.

and there are countless examples both ways that would support the stance that simply being born with a particular amount of melanin in your skin isn't what determines where you'll end up on the societal ladder.

 

[Yossarian]

come on bro @Leigh isnt that bad lol

Solid mod and solid guy on here.

 

[KWingJitsu]

I try not to ignore people unless they go out of their way to try and twist or manipulate a conversation. Kwinjitsu just comes across as a guy who has his identity wrapped up in his skin colour but would accuse anyone else of racism for feeling the same way if that person wasn't part of an ethnic minority. He's predictable but it's kind of interesting to see that there are people who really operate like he does.

LOL.
This is why I say you are mentally ill. I thought you promised to stop talking to me. I guess that didn't include talking about me eh? TRIGGERED!

It is obvious you know nothing about me. You think you do, but you don't. Everything you've said including everything you claimed I said in your previous so-called "last post" to me, is based on this imaginary Boogeyman that you have in your head. You are extremely paranoid, highly delusional and living in some kind of dystopian warped reality. Your mind is broken. You are sad. You need to fix yourself.

Since you think you know me, What is my skin color? Where am I from? Where do I live? Where was I born? Where are my parents from? For someone who thinks they know so much about me that they made up a whole bunch of shit I am supposedly wrapped up in, these questions should be easy for you to answer. And even if you could answer any of these questions, how did any of that relate to anything that I said to you in my post to you. You're angry because I was right. You have no response and you're pissed off because you've been exposed as a hypocrite, a liar and someone with deep-seated racial animosity. You are exactly part of the problem. You are allergic to facts that I presented and your only response to me is your own eroneous assumptions about skin color. Thats your only response to me. So conclusion is; You are sick in the head, your only existence in life is to argue till your face turns blue even when you're wrong. That's your color; you are - blue, and completely useless to any society, except maybe the society of mentally ill Andrew Berwick-type foreigners - who can't stop talking to, or about me.

 

[Disciplined Galt]

LOL.
This is why I say this is why I say you are mentally ill. I thought you promised to stop talking to me. I guess that didn't include talking about me eh?

it is it is obvious you know nothing about me. You think you do, but you don't. Everything you've said including everything you claimed I said in your previous so-called last post to me, is based on this imaginary Boogeyman that you have in your head. You are extremely paranoid highly delusional and living in some kind of dystopian warped reality. Your mind is broken. You are sad. You need to fix yourself.

Since you think you know me, What is my skin color? Where am I from? Where do I live? Where was I born? Where are my parents from? For someone who thinks they know so much about me that they made up a whole bunch of schitt's, these questions should be easy for you to answer. And even if you could answer any of these questions, how did any of that relate to anything that I said to you in my post to you. You're angry because I was right. you're pissed off because you've been exposed as a hypocrite a liar and someone with deep-seated racial animosity. You are exactly part of the problem. You are sick in the head, your only existence in life is to argue till your face turns blue. That's your color you are - blue, and completely useless to any society except the society of mentally ill Andrew Berwick - type foreigner who can't stop talking to or about me.

You're a cunt.
Edit: L